Episode 2

In this episode Marlon discusses how his childhood caregivers conditioned him to accept and be defenseless against abuse.

Episode-2

Podcast: Rising from the Shadows

(0:08 - 0:32)

Welcome to my podcast, rising from the shadows, building self-love after narcissistic abuse. My name is Marlon, and I'm privileged to have you join me on my journey of healing and self-discovery. In each episode, we'll dive into the challenges that I faced, the lessons I learned, and those pivotal moments along the way that led me to the profound realization of self-love.

(0:33 - 0:50)

My hope in sharing my story is that you too, like me, will start taking bold steps towards living the life that you were meant to live, and living it on your own terms. Thank you for joining me on this deeply personal journey. Let's begin.

(1:02 - 2:01)

Um, it is February 11th, 8:59 AM. I'm back recording another episode. And as I'm recording this, I'm shaking. I'm shaking because, um, um, someone must have alerted my, I guess, soon-to-be ex-wife that I made this recording last night. And just a few minutes ago, she texted me urging me to take down the podcast and leave her out of it. Um, stating it's not helpful as we finalize our divorce, and thinking about what our kids will have access to when they grow up.

(2:05 - 2:43)

You know, a common trend that I've seen every single time that I've started to stand up for myself in my childhood, in my adult life, is that abusers, perpetrators of abuse, they're enablers. They always assume that you have not thought of consequences. They always assume that you're acting irrationally.

(2:45 - 3:20)

They always assume that you're acting impulsively. They never, for one second, think that you have spent a lifetime of reasoning away any reason for you to stand up for yourself, to speak the truth. That you spent a lifetime making excuses for things said, for things done, for repeated violations, because all you think about is others.

(3:20 - 4:29)

All you think about is the feelings of others, and how it would affect others, and what people will say, and what will people think. When the Me-Too movement came out, and there was so much, um, uproar, oh, why did these, why are these women coming after Bill Cosby?

 Oh, these women, oh, this happened to them with Harvey Weinstein, but they still made the movie with him. Oh, if they're telling the truth, why did they wait so long? Right? They're just trying to get paid now that they don't have a life, right? They can't get a job, so they're just trying to take down a strong person, or a powerful person.

They're just trying to, uh, whatever. That invariably always happens, but because that happens, that's why victims don't talk. That's why victims don't talk, because when victims talk, the systems of abuse, and the enablers of that system, rise up to defend the perpetrators.

(4:30 - 5:02)

That's just a fact of life. That's why abuse works so well. Abusers have to create a situation where they're insulated from accountability. That's how they can continue that. If they were outside acting the fool 24/7, it would be too wildly obvious for anyone to support them. That's just the nature of abuse.

(5:07 - 6:23)

And as soon as they're forced to take accountability, the panic sets in, and they try to pull on the empathy, the real empathy that you have, the real knowledge of how you care about people, and how you would never want to hurt anyone, and they try to, you know, lean on that, to have you change your behavior, so they're continuously protected and insulated from having to stand face-to-face with the things that they did with no regard to you. So, I'm going to keep recording with the fear running through my body. I'm going to keep talking, despite the isolation.

(6:24- 7:55)

I am going to keep speaking truth, despite the loss of friends, family, because if my boys can grow up with an image of a dad that did hard things, regardless of the cost to him, that stood up for what was right, regardless of what it cost him, that did not just go along with abuse in order to have a modicum of affection, breadcrumbing of acknowledgement, if my boys can have an image of a dad that fought to live a life of dignity, oh God, I'd be so proud of myself. I'd be so proud of myself. God forbid that I show my children that it doesn't matter how they're being treated, because it's because they're getting that treatment from someone who claims to love them, and that should be enough, and that they should just, you know, tamp it down, because after all, that person loves you. 

(6:25- 8:38)

After all, that person's family. God forbid I let my children remain in toxic and harmful situations because they're confused, because they never saw an example of strength, they never saw an example of self-love, they never saw an example of self-determination, and so they didn't know that it was an option for them to stand up and say, no, I deserve a life of dignity, I deserve a life full of love, I deserve a life full of truth, and I have the power within myself to advocate for that and to give my own self that type of life. It doesn't need to be given to me.

(8:39- 9:34)

Oh God, I'd be so proud. I'd be so proud of myself, because that's what I never got. I spent my entire childhood watching my father berate my mother, watching my father put her down. Mind you, my father had no secondary education. My mother was educated. Mind you, my dad, you know, for all intents and purposes, if my mother hadn't been isolated away from her own network and her family, she probably would have lived a really great life.

(9:35 - 11:05)

I watched my mom struggle with autoimmune diseases, mental health, as she, you know, shrunk from the person she was before. My mom was gorgeous, beautiful, and little by little, after they joined that cult, I saw it and my dad strip her away of her dignity until he landed her in the hospital. 21 years of marriage is what she gave my father, and he left her with her mind broken, with her body broken. Look, my mom is not blameless in the raising of myself and my brothers. She was certainly a perpetrator of abuse as well, hers was more mental, controlling, coercive, like spiritually coercive, but she also enabled my father, but she was also a victim of her circumstances.

(11:08 - 11:45)

I am where I am today because I never had a picture of what healthy love and relationships look like. It was nothing to compare. I had no comparison. All I saw was pictures of controlling behavior. All I saw was pictures of unbalanced relationships. All I saw was pictures of devaluation.

(11:46 - 12:42)

All I saw was pictures of, hey, your role is to serve me. What were the examples of healthy love that I was supposed to draw from? You know, I just got to the point where I can have compassion for myself regarding that. I felt so guilty that after a life of childhood abuse and really, because I've been you know, doing the work since I was 17, 18 years old, I've been doing the work and I think I focused so much on some of these overt realities of abuse that the covert ones just slipped under my radar.

(12:43 - 13:35)

Boy, was I so mad and disappointed at myself for so long. How did I get myself back into a situation like this? But I, learning to have compassion with myself and say like, wait a minute, Marlon, where were you supposed to learn this? Where were you supposed, where were you supposed to learn what, being cherished and being honored and being respected, where were you supposed to learn about that? You had no examples. The truth is, is that from day one, I was conditioned to not fight back.

(13:36 - 14:32)

I was conditioned to not fight back against abusers because either I wouldn't be believed or people would hear me and then urge me to remain in relationship with my abusers. And if I didn't do that, if I didn't acquiesce to their requests, well, ultimately it would put me outside without access to their quote unquote love. I remember being probably, oh God, eight or nine years old at one of our cult meetings that we would have every third Saturday of the month in New York, in the Bronx, in the Bronx, yep.

(14:32 - 15:33)

And I remember there was a sister, that's what we do, we're brothers and sisters, a sister that was teaching our, what we called a Sabbath school, which for most of the Christians, they go to Sunday school, right? But we went to church on Saturday. So, she was teaching our Sabbath school. And I remember just always being brave. God, I was always such a brave little boy. I remember confiding with her then, how bad things were at home. I remember crying and saying how my father was on our backs like a taskmaster and how hard it was.

(15:34 - 16:15)

And I remember her betraying that trust because that got back to my father. And I remember him confronting me like, oh, you're talking to people, you're telling them like I'm a taskmaster on your back. I was conditioned to not bother fight back. But there was something inside of me at all times, there's always been a little spark that regardless of my circumstances, just knew that like, something's not right. You're worth more than this. This is not right.

(16:16 - 17:06)

Like you're, this is not how you're meant to live. My entire childhood, I have been very cognizant of that little voice, that little urging to free myself, to free myself. You know, in the last episode, I talked about that one time where I was beat so badly that my dad told me like not to go outside. And so, you know, when I think about it, that was probably another, it's a main memory of me being conditioned to not try and save myself.

(17:07 - 17:53)

Right? Because if I had stepped outside of my house, and someone had seen the condition that my face was, they would have undoubtedly called the police. They would have undoubtedly called the police. And my dad knew this. And this is why he had to repeatedly tell me not to go outside. Conditioned me to not try and save myself. And honestly, it was so effective. It was so effective that at the age of 17 years old, I was 17 years old. I had not cleaned my room.

(17:54 - 18:45)

And my dad asked me, why is the room not cleaned? And I said, I'm sorry, dad, I didn't get to it before the Sabbath began. So, we would, every Friday, we would clean the house from top to bottom and prepare for the Sabbath, because we didn't do any work or play or anything like that on Saturdays. So, we had it until Friday sundown to get our things together, get ready for church, et cetera, for the next day. And so, I told them, I'm sorry, dad, I wasted my time and that I didn't get to it. And his response to me was, go outside in the backyard and get me something to beat you with. 17 years old.

(18:46 - 19:13)

At that time, I was actually getting ready to go to bed. And so, I had my pajamas on. I was barefoot. I probably had socks on. I don't like my feet being cold. And without a second thought, it was just, it was just, it was second nature to me, right? My dad says, he's going to beat me. He's going to beat me. So, I walked downstairs from my bedroom. I went into the backyard and I went to the tree line, the property line.

(19:14 - 20:02)

There were some bushes and I was looking for a branch to break off so I could return and give it to him to beat me with. And I remember as, this is actually such a special memory for me, because it's one of my first memories that I remember being strong. As I was trying to break off the branches from the bush, I remember thinking, wait a minute, I'm 17 years old and my dad's going to beat me for not cleaning my room.

(20:03 - 20:50)

I can't do this. And I don't know what happened. Something inside me sparked and burned. I quietly went back upstairs to my room, still with my pajamas on. I put my sneakers on. I quietly exited the house down to the street. I remember looking up at the sky. It was night time. It was a full, beautiful moon in the sky. And I remember I looked up to the sky and I breathed the prayer. I said, God help me. And I started running.

(20:51 - 22:02)

I started running. I ran up the street, jumped the fence to a nearby shopping center where there was a Walmart. I ran into the Walmart. I ran into the back to the customer service area. Oh man. Sorry. You know, something that's really beautiful in my life is that pivotal moments. There have always been people who helped me. There have always been people who helped me. And a worker saw my face and how scared I was and just like locked in. He said, can I help you? And I said, yes. I need to call the police.

(22:03 - 22:29)

And he put a couple quarters into the payphone. There are still payphones back then. He put a couple quarters in the payphone and I called the police and told them like, hey, this is what's happening. My dad just told me to go find something to beat me with. And I just ran. I need help.

(22:31 - 23:38)

And after I finished talking to police, that worker put me in the break room to keep me safe until the police came. I'm so thankful for him. I don't know his name. Thank you. Thank you. The night wasn't done. The police came in. I met them out front. And I had actually also called two people from church that I had become very close to.

(23:39 - 24:13)

And they showed up as well. And I explained my situation to the police. But we were in a pickle because he hadn't actually beat me yet. It was just his intent to. So, there was really nothing that they could do to, you know, save me from this situation. And then something happened again.

(24:14 - 25:24)

Where I told them, listen, you have to understand the way my dad is. I told them, when you call him and he comes here, he's going to start talking to you all calmly, very rationally, very put together. He's an intelligent man. And I don't even know how I could know and think to tell them this next detail. I said, he's going to sell you this. If I am so abusive to Marlon, if I am so controlling, why is it that he has a cell phone? It's kind of an absurd detail for me to feel that I needed to share with them. But let me tell you something. When they called my father and he drove up, everything that I said would happen, happened. Down to the detail about the cell phone.

(25:25 - 26:23)

The police officers looked at each other like, holy shit. When my dad did say, if I'm so controlling, if I'm so abusive, why does he have a personal cell phone? And then when they didn't acquiesce to him right away, he practically shoved one of the female cops that were there. And that's when the cops got in his face. And then he started acting like a victim. They like, oh, if I'm such a bad man, arrest me now, arrest me now. And he put his hands on, on the hood of the car, making a spectacle. But he was acting irrational enough that they were like, okay, we need to do something about this. There's no cause for like separation or, you know, arrest or anything like that. We have nothing there.

(26:24 - 27:13)

Luckily, my older brother, who had recently emancipated himself, because he was 18 at that point, was able to come and they said, we'll let you go home with your brother. Right. So, it's, you know, it's not kidnapping. I'm just visiting my brother, you know, what have you. Um, so that's, that's what happened. And that was the first time I remember being strong, standing up for myself in the face of insurmountable odds, with no proof, no one believing me.

(27:14 - 28:16)

You know, that experience gave me so much confidence that I had the ability to create a life that I could live in with dignity. But even though that was the last time I was ever threatened to, or physically abused by my father, the conditioning was set in. And that's what I failed to realize, that I was out of the physical environment where the beatings had ensued.

(28:18 - 29:59)

But the conditioning to be abused by a loved one, and then be forced to accept them taking care of me after they felt the shame about the damage, but only for them to do it again and again. Abuse. I'm sorry. Let me make it better. Abuse. I'm sorry. Let it make, let me make it better. Yeah. That conditioning stayed in me for years to come. And it was because of one core belief that was planted in me from the beginning. And it was that I was not good. The way that I was, was not good. Excuse me. And it needed to change, and it needed to be improved. And all those changes, all those improvements, they would be determined by an exterior force. It was never my internal desire to be better. To be different or what have you. It was always an exterior influence that would say like, I don't like that. This is how it should be. And because I believed in myself that. 

(30:00 - 31:31)

I wasn't good and everybody else was better and that I was broken and everybody else was healthy. I accepted that determination from people but the fact of the matter is all that stuff all that abuse was things that happened to me but throughout my life in my own family dynamic with my siblings with my parents etc. I've always been the truth teller I've always been the one that fought back I've always been the one that said this is not right we cannot normalize this we cannot keep pretending just to get along I've always had the healthiest response to trauma and abuse which is to get help to get help not to keep secrets not to make excuses for perpetrators not to weaponize family members in order to shut up the people that are speaking the truth God.

(31:32 - 32:49)

 I'm so thankful for that trait that I have like I don't know where it came from I'm just lucky I don't know why I grew up in the same household as my brothers and I just have a different reaction to it all I don't know why I'm a true seeker I don't know why I've been this intellectually curious about myself in the world I honestly think it's just a you know draw the straw but I'm so thankful for it I'm so thankful for knowing always knowing that I mattered always knowing that I deserve to live a life worth living oh I'm so thankful for that okay this was another 30 minutes it's a hard one let's stop for now.